Thursday, July 30, 2009

The Advanced Theory of Rock: Who is Advanced?

Advanced Theory is an idea about musicians we like and the choices they make that we hate. It is very hard to explain, much like quantum physics. The following is a (chat log) discussion (between me and old friend Eddie Tomayko) and introduction to the concept. It should be noted that I was drunk, but lucid.

(11:37:50 PM) maximumsp: [Billy] corgan has become... i dont know what
(11:38:03 PM) maximumsp: something to loathe?
(11:38:29 PM) maximumsp: have you heard of Advanced Theory?
(11:38:45 PM) lemon031: i wouldnt say that but he's fallen into that hole a lot of once huge artists do... where they think they can collaborate with whoever and put out gold when in fact it's just shit
(11:38:50 PM) lemon031: no
(11:39:20 PM) maximumsp: Advanced Theory is perplexing... it basically states that any artist who does something terrible is advanced to a higher level
(11:39:34 PM) maximumsp: i dont understand Lou Reed to this day, but he is Advanced.
(11:39:42 PM) maximumsp: so is Val Kilmer, according to the theorists
(11:39:55 PM) maximumsp: i shouldnt have used the word 'any'
(11:40:06 PM) lemon031: lol
(11:40:22 PM) lemon031: so let me think of someone who qualifies
(11:40:25 PM) lemon031: hmm
(11:40:46 PM) lemon031: bruce campbell?
(11:40:53 PM) maximumsp: someone who does something disappointing or uncharacteristic
(11:41:01 PM) maximumsp: i would have to think about Bruce...
(11:41:03 PM) lemon031: i guess he doesnt count
(11:41:11 PM) lemon031: bc it was meant as farce
(11:41:27 PM) lemon031: how about isiah thomas post playing days
(11:41:39 PM) maximumsp: dont know enough about him anymore
(11:42:04 PM) lemon031: just a comically terribad coach/gm of the knicks
(11:42:22 PM) maximumsp: trying to remember what i read
(11:42:54 PM) maximumsp: trying to pick a sports star that fits the theory
(11:43:17 PM) lemon031: manny
(11:43:19 PM) maximumsp: i would say Shaq, but i dunno sports arent my forte
(11:43:24 PM) maximumsp: holy shit youre right
(11:43:25 PM) maximumsp: MAN RAM
(11:43:30 PM) lemon031: lol
(11:43:36 PM) maximumsp: fucking noble
(11:43:37 PM) lemon031: nah shaq doesnt fit
(11:44:17 PM) lemon031: im trying to think of a political example
(11:44:21 PM) maximumsp: Bob Dylan selling out for a Victoria's Secret commerical = ADVANCED
(11:44:33 PM) lemon031: lol def
(11:44:33 PM) maximumsp: http://advancedtheory.blogspot.com

(11:46:06 PM) lemon031: politics has to be sarah barracuda
(11:46:18 PM) maximumsp: hmm maybe
(11:46:24 PM) lemon031: who else can quit their job and be about to get rich as shit
(11:46:39 PM) maximumsp: i think one of the rules is that you have to have an un-ironic mullet at some point... so that discounts her
(11:46:51 PM) lemon031: hahaha
(11:47:21 PM) lemon031: well look at her hairdos back from her early sportscaster days. looks like "the real housewives of 1983 new jersey"
(11:47:40 PM) maximumsp: i gotta write this shit down
(11:47:56 PM) lemon031: haha
(11:48:12 PM) lemon031: newt gingrich
(11:48:14 PM) maximumsp: i wish i had my book here so i could read passages
(11:48:20 PM) maximumsp: i dunno about Newt
(11:48:28 PM) lemon031: no hear me out
(11:48:49 PM) lemon031: heads up the contract with america, hammers clinton for fucking monica lewinsky
(11:48:59 PM) lemon031: ends up he's cheating on like his 3rd wife
(11:49:15 PM) lemon031: ends up near the head of the party today
(11:49:24 PM) lemon031: could say the same about rush limbaugh too
(11:49:54 PM) maximumsp: i dunno what Rush did that was advanced
(11:50:07 PM) maximumsp: painkillers?
(11:50:15 PM) lemon031: railed on drug users for being weak minded forever and then turns out he's a pillhead
(11:50:22 PM) lemon031: now he's bigger (pun intended) than ever
(11:50:55 PM) maximumsp: there's also something called OVERT in the theory, that means something hypocritical is done that isnt advanced
(11:51:08 PM) maximumsp: so Rush is overt, because he is TRYING to be advanced


(11:51:30 PM) lemon031: is there a place on this blog that lays out the rules to this theory
(11:51:49 PM) maximumsp: i only read it in a Chuck Klosterman book
(11:51:59 PM) lemon031: lol which one
(11:52:07 PM) lemon031: i have IV and sex drugs and whatever downtairs
(11:52:09 PM) maximumsp: but i am told Lou Reed embodies the definition
(11:52:15 PM) maximumsp: yes IV has it
(11:52:19 PM) maximumsp: i read it a few wks ago
(11:52:22 PM) lemon031: kk
(11:52:32 PM) maximumsp: look up Reed in the index in the back
(11:53:34 PM) lemon031: dude
(11:53:36 PM) lemon031: this is weird
(11:54:06 PM) lemon031: i just got this book a couple weeks ago, and i put the receipt from the univ bookstore on the very page that has the "advanced" topic
(11:54:22 PM) maximumsp: the universe is advanced.
(11:55:15 PM) maximumsp: i found it online
(11:55:20 PM) lemon031: lol just read the first paragraph elucidating this theory. there couldn't be a more apt example than lou reed
(11:55:36 PM) maximumsp: lou reed vexes me
(11:55:56 PM) maximumsp: http://www.esquire.com/features/music/ESQ0704-JULY_AMERICA
(11:56:20 PM) lemon031: jackson pollock
(11:56:25 PM) maximumsp: basically i remember that being Advanced means being misunderstood until generations later
(11:56:49 PM) maximumsp: like Oscar Wilde
(11:56:52 PM) maximumsp: who MUST be advanced
(11:57:02 PM) lemon031: good one


(12:05:19 AM) lemon031: michael jackson fits the bill based on the line in the book
(12:05:35 AM) maximumsp: he had a mullet for sure
(12:05:57 AM) lemon031: when i legitimate genius does something that seems crazy, it does not mean they suddenly suck, what it means is that they are doing something that you cannot understand b/c you are not Advanced
(12:06:14 AM) lemon031: what better explains the last 15 years of michael jackson?
(12:06:26 AM) maximumsp: yah
(12:06:54 AM) lemon031: i now must question my categorization of manny ramirez
(12:07:11 AM) lemon031: everyone knows he's a basket case, it's expected he does stupid shit
(12:07:14 AM) maximumsp: if he's not advanced, i dunno what to dthink
(12:07:48 AM) lemon031: lol
(12:07:52 AM) lemon031: line from the book:
(12:08:11 AM) lemon031: "when kurt cobain collaborated with william s. burrougs in 1992, it defined overt"
(12:09:10 AM) lemon031: i have my own theory
(12:09:15 AM) maximumsp: perhaps Kirst Novoselic
(12:10:16 AM) lemon031: i think miley cyrus embodies a possible corollary of klosterman's theory
(12:10:29 AM) maximumsp: ok
(12:11:18 AM) lemon031: any child star of a person who qualifies for most of the Advanced theory will without exception crash and burn
(12:11:56 AM) maximumsp: you need to read the piece about Morrissey/Smiths in that book... its perplexing to me as well
(12:12:08 AM) lemon031: kk looking it up
(12:13:28 AM) lemon031: ok i just burst out laughing at whoever said in the first paragraph he cries to whatever gay ass morissey song lol
(12:13:49 AM) maximumsp: i admit i have only heard like maybe 2 total Smiths/Moz songs ever
(12:14:01 AM) lemon031: me too
(12:14:06 AM) lemon031: because they all suck
(12:14:18 AM) maximumsp: HAHAHAHA
(12:15:22 AM) lemon031: lol im serious its just the same qq woe is me bullshit. i'd rather listen to nirvana or the pumpkins and get that with at least some musical value thrown in
(12:15:57 AM) maximumsp: youd think the latino culture would ident. with someone else
(12:16:23 AM) lemon031: yeah this is fascinating
(12:17:39 AM) maximumsp: i am craving Denny's right now
(12:17:49 AM) lemon031: you son of a bitch
(12:17:58 AM) lemon031: denny's would be amazing right now
(12:18:04 AM) maximumsp: there isnt one within 100 miles of me methinks
(12:18:22 AM) lemon031: you have a sonic at least right
(12:18:33 AM) maximumsp: 35 min drive there
(12:18:38 AM) lemon031: damn
(12:19:04 AM) lemon031: sonic tortures me. nearest one is in iowa (200 miles away) yet they advertise on tv here all the gd time
(12:19:50 AM) maximumsp: hmm
(12:19:59 AM) maximumsp: New England doesnt have sonic either...
(12:20:00 AM) lemon031: after more thought and reading the book i think hillary clinton is the political example of the Advanced Theory
(12:20:18 AM) maximumsp: so she's the best fit?
(12:20:30 AM) lemon031: absolutely
(12:20:38 AM) lemon031: she hates obama, anyone can tell
(12:20:51 AM) lemon031: she's a brilliant politician, anyone should agree
(12:21:26 AM) lemon031: yet she took the SoS job. i think this is all part of her grand scheme.
(12:21:30 AM) maximumsp: i dunno what she did that is advanced
(12:21:31 AM) maximumsp: oh
(12:21:32 AM) maximumsp: i see
(12:22:26 AM) maximumsp: with politics it is SO about doing the unexpected to catch your opponents off guard
(12:22:43 AM) lemon031: a year ago if you told me hillary would accept a spot in obamas cabinet i would have told you to shut up
(12:22:43 AM) maximumsp: so im lost when it comes to applying Adv Theory
(12:23:07 AM) maximumsp: a year ago i woulda said theyd team up to annihilate the opposition
(12:23:08 AM) lemon031: no i am obsessed with politics believe me this qualifies
(12:23:22 AM) lemon031: never would have happened
(12:23:52 AM) lemon031: the clintons have their own little wing of the democratic party and they think they can just lord over everyone else
(12:24:45 AM) maximumsp: if Clinton had left the Demo party for a fourth-rate party that would be super-Adv in my book
(12:24:55 AM) maximumsp: but yet they stay Demo
(12:25:05 AM) lemon031: 4th?
(12:25:16 AM) maximumsp: i dunno i cant name one
(12:25:33 AM) lemon031: ha but there's not even a viable 3rd
(12:25:59 AM) lemon031: i'm standing by this
(12:27:11 AM) lemon031: hillary was the clear frontrunner for 08. obama comes out of nowhere and clobbers her and its clear the two don't like each other. who would expect she'd leave her cushy seat in the senate and go work for her nemesis?
(12:28:12 AM) lemon031: we should make a podcast to discuss this. people would listen

(12:29:22 AM) maximumsp: i would think Diddy would be advanced. because he is so... i dunno random?
(12:29:54 AM) lemon031: once you've moved into caricature territory i don't think you really qualify anymore
(12:30:36 AM) maximumsp: im gonna email this advanced theory blog guy and ask about people
(12:31:25 AM) lemon031: i am taking back my palin thing after thinking about it. too overt
(12:31:40 AM) lemon031: hillary though. send that in your email
(12:31:41 AM) maximumsp: palin is like britney spears... its like the brain cells are not there
(12:32:16 AM) maximumsp: Al Gore?
(12:32:26 AM) lemon031: how so
(12:32:44 AM) maximumsp: after losing the election he just kinda went Ted Kaczynski
(12:33:10 AM) lemon031: nah
(12:33:41 AM) lemon031: he speaks mostly the truth, whether or not you agree it's not like he's just batshit crazy
(12:34:13 AM) maximumsp: speaking of batshit... Mike Gravel?
(12:34:14 AM) lemon031: i dont know if this qualifies b/c he's not well known (before this) but what about the south carolina governor mark sanford
(12:34:42 AM) lemon031: lol that guy is a piece of shit
(12:34:50 AM) maximumsp: i dont know enough about his situation
(12:35:04 AM) lemon031: the dude that was basically missing for a week
(12:35:26 AM) maximumsp: but if you do the opposite of 'wholesome', youre overt
(12:35:29 AM) lemon031: then his reps said he was hiking on the appalachian trail
(12:35:51 AM) lemon031: but it turns out he took a flight to argentina to f his mistress
(12:36:09 AM) maximumsp: yes i know this
(12:36:31 AM) lemon031: nobody ever expected it right, doesnt that qualify?
(12:36:51 AM) maximumsp: again, with politics i dont know if the theory is sound enough
(12:37:27 AM) lemon031: dude leave the politics to me, you can figure out the music part. we should write a book about this
(12:38:04 AM) maximumsp: i need to study and digest it a little
(12:38:20 AM) lemon031: alright.
(12:38:32 AM) maximumsp: right now im thinking OJ simpson
(12:38:33 AM) lemon031: everything i've said is my intellectual property
(12:39:00 AM) maximumsp: or George Lucas HOLY HELL
(12:39:16 AM) maximumsp: Howard the Duck/Goonies = spielberg + lucas advanced
(12:39:17 AM) maximumsp: holy shit
(12:39:37 AM) lemon031: OJ is probably in the Advanced Theory hall of fame
(12:39:41 AM) maximumsp: OJ Simpson in the Naked Gun movies = ADVANCED
(12:39:45 AM) maximumsp: HOLY
(12:40:58 AM) lemon031: i think though that we run the risk of including guys that had a good run then just slipped into obscurity. i mean if OJ hadn't slain those peeps
(12:41:17 AM) lemon031: so is phil spector included here? i don't wanna say yes
(12:41:22 AM) maximumsp: obscure sometimes equals advanced
(12:41:37 AM) maximumsp: not sure... those hairdos may be advanced
(12:41:49 AM) lemon031: lol you mean wigs
(12:41:53 AM) maximumsp: yah


Basically we came to the conclusion that the following people are Advanced, even though they are not musicians:

  1. Manny Ramirez (for "Manny being Manny")
  2. OJ Simpson (for the Naked Gun films) Note: SUPER ADVANCED
  3. George Lucas (for Howard the Duck, Temple of Doom and the Star Wars prequels)
  4. Steven Spielberg (for any terrible film that he executive produced)
  5. Hillary Clinton (for allying with nemesis Obama in the Cabinet)
Furthermore, Bob Dylan is ultra-Advanced. For post-motorcycle crash music, becoming a born-again Christian, and appearing into a Victoria's Secret commercial. This, to me, defines Advancement.

There will be further discussion on this...

No comments:

Post a Comment

MST3k Return thoughts

There used to be two camps when it comes to MSTies: Team Joel or Team Mike. I'm in the Michael J. Nelson camp (the 1997 Sci-Fi Channel ...